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Hope and pray that it will continue

Author: ronsue
Maybe this is an answer to prayer. My website, innerwindow.net, is on Google Sites and is free. It has never had any downtime, that I know of.  Attached are two images from this site. Again thanks for all your work on this site and all your other endeavors. http://innerwindows.net

You are welcome.

Author: Richard Schletty
I wish more people would take advantage of this opportunity to post their original songs of faith. This website, hosted by InMotion Hosting, had been going offline for anywhere between 5 and 30 minutes at a time, daily, for the past few months. InMotion switched me to a different web server but that had the same downtime issue. Last week they migrated my websites to a third web server and that seems to be more stable now. Fingers crossed. InMotion is one of the few web hosting companies that...

Thank You

Author: ronsue
Thank you Richard  for developing, maintaining, contributing to, and funding this website  May the Good Lord bless you in all your work. Ron St Martin

O God, for you my soul is thirsting

Author: Richard Schletty
Thanks, Ron, for your heartfelt arrangement of this psalm of yearning for God. May God save us all and bring tranquility to the world.

A message of true joy

Author: Richard Schletty
Reminiscent of 60s-70s folk ballads. Articulately and beautifully sung. I love the guitar arpeggio. Simple yet rich in the spirit of rejoicing. Good ambience.

Soulful, smooth praise

Author: Richard Schletty
A most appropriate approach to reflecting on the goodness of the Lord. Your sung melody and guitar accompaniment soothe the weary soul and direct our thoughts to the God of Creation. Thank you for sharing.

Beautiful

Author: Richard Schletty
This has a prayerful, peaceful and calming feeling. Beautiful singing. Another psalm well done. 

Thanks. Pa

Author: ronsue
The good Lord always seeks his beloved lost sheep and asks us to help him to seek and bring him to him.  

Thanks for the reminders

Author: ronsue
Yes, many saints have reminded us throughout salvation history of the presence of the angels in personal and social contexts.  The Angel of Portugal appeared and prepared the children at Fatima for the coming of Mary, queen of angels. St Padre Pio often spoke of angels and the important work they do in our behalf Ron St Martin

Thanks

Author: ronsue
Your comments are part of our yearning to see the good Lord in his   radiant glory! Congratulations on your new archbishop Richard Henning!  

Yes!

Author: Jeremy St Martin
Help us now! That great day is coming ever closer.  This song helps ster in us the hope for our own salvation and glorification. That will be a great and ever new glorious song. And even our bodies will be saved! To be carried will be great.  No more trying and striving. Thank you!

So Important

Author: Jeremy St Martin
It is so important to think of the Angels. We read about them throught the Bible and we refer to them in detail in the Mass. So many of us forget that we are not fighting the battle on our own. There are armies of angels fighting along with us. The bad angels are doomed. Did you know that we know about the Chiors of angels from ancient science?  It is hard to imagine but they are part of ancient Greek metaphisics.   It is similar to how modern science is discovers invisible...

Wonderful Peace

Author: Jeremy St Martin
It is so comforting. The melody and the voice is both strong and gentle, old and new. It makes you want to look up to God in a way that is pleasing and acceptable to him. God is good.  

Thanks for all your contributions to us on this site and your of

Author: ronsue
Thanks for all your contributions to us on this site and your offer to provide resources to inspire us to new hymns. Ron St Martin

Guardian Angel hymns

Author: Don9of11
A number of Catholic hymns honoring our Guardian angels appeared in Catholic hymn books over the years. However, by the 1960s, most had been removed from Catholic hymnals.  Here is a sample of hymns: Dear Angel! Ever at my side, How loving must thou be How kind it is of you to come, Bright angel from yon starry home Tho' awake or sleeping, Thou art at my side Hark! Hark! My Soul, angelic songs are swelling Guardian angel, From heav'n so bright. Ye Cherubim and Seraphim, Around my Maker's...

This hymn was in the office

Author: ronsue
This hymn was in the office of readings in the liturgy of the hours a week or so ago. The name of the hymn is YE Holy Angels Bright. This is the link to the lyrics of that song. https://www.blueletterbible.org/hymns/y/Ye_Holy_Angels_Bright.cfm  Thanks for the comment.

Richard Baxter, 1731-1789

Author: Jeremy St Martin
What is the Richard Baxter reference material?  It would be interesting to see.  How did you come aross it? Again, sorry for any mispellings.

Make it better

Author: Jeremy St Martin
below is # 165 from the compendium of the Catechism of the Catholic Church.  I would study that to see an example of how we are to capitalize things.  You made a mistake in there a few times in that regard and I am sure you would want to clean it up as your product is so good and worthy of aclaim. Sorry I can't spell but this is just a comment and of little worth. 165. In what way is the Church holy? 823-829  867 The Church is holy insofar as the Most Holy God is her...

Good Morning

Author: Jeremy St Martin
I would consult with the Poet Susan St. Martin to understand the art of capitalization better.  She is a trustworthy source and a kind helper indeed. It doesn't look at all right to me and is almost irreverent captitalization.  It is at least confusing. If you don't know what I am refering to please consult with Susan St. Martin. In Christ, Jeremy

New recording

Author: ronsue
Recorded with some new lyrics.

Wow!

Author: Jeremy St Martin
That is great!

thanks

Author: ronsue
Having the lyrics helps us who have some hearing loss. Rhanks Ron Adioz

What does do a cover mean? Thanks for the comment.

Author: ronsue
What does do a cover mean? Thanks for the comment.

I think Deacon Chuck should do a cover as should Mr. Ricci.

Author: Jeremy St Martin
I think Deacon Chuck should do a cover as should Mr. Ricci.

Timely

Author: Jeremy St Martin
Feels like a royal march.  I love the fitting strength of positivity!   "All praise and Glory" has an amazing high note that you really make ring.  Again on the word "heven" there is that high note.  Wow.  

Thank you

Author: Jeremy St Martin
This is great.  God is good.  Good to have in the wake of Corpus Crisiti.

Changed some lyrics

Author: ronsue
Recorded anew because of changed lyrics

Yes

Author: Jeremy St Martin
This would be good for my deaf friends as well.  Lyrics?

Lyrics

Author: ronsue
Could you please post the lyrics THanks Ron ​​​​​​

Great lyrics

Author: ronsue
Thanks for posting. The lyrics are good for reflection and the guitar work is smooth and the musical arrangements complement the atmosphere of the lyrics. Keep the songs coming. Adios Ron

A sound and a devil

Author: Richard Schletty
"The Lord had offered a piece of bread". Oh how we all need to realize this. and accept spiritual nourishment. Nice song. Good lyrics. Good instrumentation. Love that slide guitar.

Thank. You

Author: ronsue
Thanks for the critique. I didn't notice one misspelling.  Adieu Ron

Adaptation of Persevere With Good Cheer

Author: Richard Schletty
Fr. Jeremy: No, it's not ready yet. But thanks for asking. I should be able to carve out some time this week. I just finished making changes to the piano-voice-guitar arrangement of "When We Go to Mass" – a song for faith formation for kids. Look for it soon!

Can't wait to see the new song

Author: Jeremy St Martin
This is amazing.  Is the new song ready yet?

So True

Author: Jeremy St Martin
This reminds me of the psalm (I think it is a psalm) that talks about how a thousand fall at my right 10 thousand on my right but it will (the army) not aproach with you at my side as my buckler and shield.   That concept of putting trust in nothing except God is so great.  Even if an army is set up agains me I will not feer if God is with me. Your song is so good for pointing out all the fauls hopes we have in so many ways and how we should trust in the Lord alone. Thank you...

Thanks Ron

Author: ronsue
Thanks for all you are doing. Ron

Persevere

Author: Richard Schletty
I am working on some ideas. Back in a few days,.

Yes that would be good. You can do whatever you think Thanks Ron

Author: ronsue
Yes, that would be good. You can do whatever you judge to improve the song. Thanks, Ron.

John 16: 33

Author: Richard Schletty
With your permission, I would like to rework this song. I believe it has possibilities. Let me know. I think it would be more engaging with a traditional verse-chorus structure to keep it from being monotonous. There are some good words in there based on John 16: 33.

House of God

Author: Richard Schletty
Dan Vi, I am happy for you. Keep writing about the goodness of God as you dwell in the Spirit. Good to hear from you.

House of God

Author: asiansa09
Thank God, Jesus Christ & the Holy Family in sainthood's direction, for two years as I am living a peaceful life in the house of God.

Better than the page I gave from USCCB

Author: Richard Schletty
Fr. Martin, your page link is better than the one I gave from the very same website. It has all the prayers given in full. I posted: https://www.usccb.org/prayers/how-pray-chaplet-divine-mercy You posted: https://www.usccb.org/prayers/chaplet-divine-mercy Hey, I am not trying to be critical. I am critiquing. Big difference. I think the main bone of contention, as Ron pointed out, is whether to capitalize deity pronouns. I don't think anyone is in favor of using lowercase for terms like...

Here is an interesting

Author: Jeremy St Martin
Here is an interesting website: https://www.usccb.org/prayers/chaplet-divine-mercy

I went to the Website.

Author: Jeremy St Martin
The website?   I would imagine the the Lord the words and not in English. Who has the translation authority into English in our own day and age. If these are the Lord's own words these questions are not unimportant. If we want others to come to believe we need to take the care, not of a pharasee, but of and artist. In Christ, Fr. St. Martin  

Which Proud Pharasies?

Author: Jeremy St Martin
I can't spell so please don't read if you can't stand misspellings. Yes.  Thank you for saying that we are all sinners and in need of his mercy.  It is just a big temptation to think of "them" and "us" and not really be thinking we are proud pharasies. Jesus was a pharsee.  Is God proud? The pharsees who were critizied by Christ were religious leaders who had real athority, knowledge of scripturre, observed religiuous precepts, honored the...

Amen Ron!

Author: ckelley
2-True! Thank you Ron for the distinction - you are spot-on. As one of my favorite pastors used to say; "there is nothing new under the sun"...    the brokeness of humanity and associated faults & failings are well represented in each of us who also have the digntity of the human person, made in the image and likeness of God, all of which needs mercy! Will be praying for y'all - and myself this Divine Mercy Sunday! Pax Christi.  Deacon Chuck

Spelling, grammar and good formatting

Author: Richard Schletty
Correct spelling is "pharisaically". "Bad spellers of the world.... untie!"  – Love it! Use a spell checker! I do when I write emails and compose lyrics and other text. I usually run a spell check after I am done typing. Realtime spell checking is OK, too, but can sometimes break my "flow" when typing. When writing poetry or lyrics, good formatting is essential. It makes you look more professional. I recommend that members of this website prepare...

But the divine mercy calls for mercy on PROUD pharaisees

Author: ronsue
The prayer does not accuse or condemn a pharisee. The pharisee tries to live out with precise devotion the Torah.  St  Paul was such a pharisee the good Lord had mercy on him - his intentions. The Lord contrasts the PROUD pharisee praying in the temple with the poor sinner asking for mercy. The divine mercy prayer calls for mercy on ALL of us - we are all sinners falling short in one way or another to some degree or another of the pure Love of Christ.  That is why The good Lord...

It's not the capitalization... it's your spelling.

Author: ckelley
"hypocrite"   "pharisee"  "accusatory"   Bad spellers of the world....    untie!  

Good Morning

Author: Jeremy St Martin
Great to have consistancy with the Holy Mother the Church when it comes to Capitalization.  It may be that I or you want different but what does that mater.  We become the pharazise if we think we know better than the proper authorities. About the calling of people pharasitical, it just doesn't come across to me as self acusatory.  There is a desire for some people to be called out as pharasees. Becareful of that attitude.  In a way the Pharasees called out Christ as a...

No sweat

Author: Richard Schletty
It's not "wrong" to use lower case. There are some bibles and lectionaries that use this convention. For example, the Gloria from the current English Roman Missal: Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace to people of good will. We praise you, we bless you, we adore you, we glorify you, we give you thanks for your great glory, Lord God, heavenly King, O God, almighty Father. Lord Jesus Christ, Only Begotten Son, Lord God, Lamb of God, Son of the Father, you take away the...

Sorry about the inconsistency

Author: ronsue
I went to a website (I believe it may have been one that Richard pointed out) to get the exact words of the chaplet prayer. The personal pronouns for the Lord were capitalized and in expanding the prayer I used lowercase. I am trying to use all lowercase as you pointed that the church is using all lowercase.  I didn't call you or anyone else in particular in this expanded version of the chaplet. I just asked for mercy and for the heavenly Father to send the Holy Spirit on anyone of US...

Reverential capitalization

Author: Richard Schletty
Fr. Jeremy, I assume that this is a question for Ron. You and I discussed this in an email exchange a couple months ago. There are two camps in Catholic and Christian circles: those that use reverential capitalization and those who do not. It's generally regarded as a matter of personal preference. Personally, I prefer reverential capitalization. For the Divine Mercy Chaplet, both USCCB and the Vatican use reverential capitalization: https://www.usccb.org/prayers/how-pray-chaplet-divine-...

Question

Author: Jeremy St Martin
I noticed that you used reverential capitalization at times and at other times you did not us reverential capitalization.  I hope I am not becoming pharisiticaly proud in asking this question.  It is important to me that the word of God be praised and the truth of Jesus be proclaimed in not uncertain terms.  If those who claim to love the Lord don't even care about reverential language when it concerns the Lord how can we expect salvation never mind attract others to the Lord?...

Chant settings of holy words

Author: Richard Schletty
Ron, you may have noticed Dan Vi's original post. Check out the comments to see the progression of our collaboration: www.topcatholicsongs.com/for-the-love-of-humanity I am not sure if the "messages from Christ to Sr. Faustina" that Dan Vi posted are exact or if she paraphrased them slightly. I used Dan Vi's stanzas with a few minor modifications to create my chant version with dulcimer. Then I heavily reworked the "messages from Christ" to create my rhyming song. I...

Thanks for the clarification

Author: ronsue
In listening to them I gathered the lyrics were inspired from the messages of our Lord to St Faustina and to us. Ron 

Clarification

Author: Richard Schletty
I should clarify that the two songs that Dan Vi and I did are based on messages from Christ to St. Faustina. They are not based on the Divine Mercy Chaplet written by St. Faustina. That explains the big difference in the words. 

It is good to hear various chants of the divine mercy chaplet.

Author: ronsue
Thanks for posting these variations on the divine mercy chaplet

Sister Faustina, Divine Mercy Chaplet

Author: Richard Schletty
Thanks for posting this Divine Mercy Chaplet. I reposted my two collaborative songs (right under this story) that were done with Dan Vi Nguyen a few years ago. It is nice to hear various songs and chants based on the good words of Sr. Faustina.

So happy to hear your psalter is complete!

Author: Richard Schletty
Congratulations. This is great news. Your psalms are resplendent with artistry and grace. They are food for the hungry soul. I hope you find a way to get the psalm settings engraved as sheet music for voice, piano and guitar (plus some with violin).

Eternally new Eternally now.

Author: ronsue
Yes we have to do it again and again and again unto the fullness of life in heavenly glory

Timely

Author: Jeremy St Martin
Eternally Timely.  It is a new song.  You have fullfilled the comand to sing a new song unto the Lord.  Imposible for nothing is new under the son. However it means do it again.  Even if we try to do it exactly the same way we can't help but do it in a new way.  This is always the case and so all things under the son are always new and eternal in the fact that they always grow up to the invinite source.  

Nos defende: Defend us!

Author: Richard Schletty
I failed to take notice of this song when you posted it last fall. Interesting song. I need to run it through Google Translator to absorb the commentary. Thanks for mentioning Synthesizer V by Dreamtonics. You just wrote to me and said it was used to produce the woman's voice in this song. I am interested in this tech for my own songs!

Synthesizer V

Author: Guillaume
"I would like to try AI to "sing" the soprano and alto voices of my compositions. I have been using Ircam Trax by Flux to transform and pitch shift my own recorded voice." Then you may be interested by Synthesizer V by Dreamtonics. It has very realistic voices, as you can hear it in my last song.  

AI raises many questions

Author: Richard Schletty
Thanks for letting me know about Suno.ai. Guillaume wrote: "I am aware it raises many questions, to which I have no answer yet." Well said! I have many questions, too. I would like to try AI to "sing" the soprano and alto voices of my compositions. I have been using Ircam Trax by Flux to transform and pitch shift my own recorded voice.

Suno AI

Author: Guillaume
Thank you! I did not use Chat GPT but Suno. The process is very simple: you type some lyrics (I used lyrics written by Frederick W. Faber) and the genre of music you want to have. And that's all... I am aware it raises many questions, to which I have no answer yet...

AI generated songs of adoration

Author: Richard Schletty
These two songs are full of gusto. Very proclamatory. They have the energy and feel of a sea shanty/chanty. I have my reservations about the use of AI for composing songs, but these both sound very good. What ChatGPT prompts did you use? Which version of ChatGPT? What AI app or service did you use?

You're welcome. Have joyful Solemnity!

Author: ronsue
Have a Joy-filled solemnity. Ron St Martin

Thanks for the reminder of the Feast of St. Joseph

Author: Richard Schletty
I had forgotten to post my Spanish version of the responsorial psalm for March 19. I just posted it! As usual, thank you for your worshipful artistry.

True

Author: Jeremy St Martin
and weep especially for our own ignorance, poor catechesis, poor education, cultural confusion, pride, etc.

Yes

Author: ronsue
Yes in this time as in other times when a significant number of people reject(ed) the good Lord for whatever reason (ignorance, poor catechesis, poor education, cultural confusion, pride, etc) we the body of Christ should weep as the Lord wept. 

Timely

Author: Jeremy St Martin
Good Prayer for our day and age.  Saints of Jerusalem, pray for us.

Hail Mary

Author: Richard Schletty
Could it be the setting by James Marchionda? https://youtu.be/H9FmOVZ9y7s?si=_mqs0gXCcC6ct4Lw https://hymnary.org/hymn/OIF2014/page/1206

A Pure Heart Create for Me

Author: Richard Schletty
Sung with pure tones and pleasing acoustic arpeggios. Dreamy and worshipful. Thanks for sharing. 

Hail Mary sung in church

Author: Richard Schletty
Perhaps you heard "Hail Mary, Gentle Woman" by Carey Landry.  https://youtu.be/OUey6ytEXqY?si=uIb-hsy0HbkkeQSK I have sung it often with my church choir.  Allow me to put in a pitch for a song I helped record and publish. The melody is by Tony Moran: Hail Mary (track 16) https://insong.org/product/faith-songs-for-kids/ https://insong.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/16-Hail-Mary.mp3 https://insong.org/wp-content/uploads/woocommerce_uploads/2022/09/Sheet-music-Faith-Songs-...

I am looking for a Hail Mary song that we used to sing at church

Author: Clam19
additionally, It is a song that is sung very slowly.

I am looking for a Hail Mary song that we used to sing at church

Author: Clam19
Hello, can anyone help me, please and thank you, find the Hail Mary song with the following lyrics: Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you, Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb, Jesus Jesus Blessed is the fruit of your womb Jesus Holy Mary, Mother of God, Pray for us, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death, Hail Mary, full of grace, Hail Mary...

A rich history of a beloved song

Author: Richard Schletty
Thank you for your review of an "oldie but goodie" hymn. I like the lyrics and the various keyboard arrangements. You sure do a thorough job of showcasing not just the hymn but its lyricist and manifold melodic composers. Looking forward to next month's Hymn of the Month.

Wow

Author: Jeremy St Martin
That was a good one.  Amen! Trully new!

Collaboration

Author: Richard Schletty
I'll be in touch, Brian. 

RE: Collaborate on Songs

Author: brianjtucker
Hi Richard, thanks for getting back to me, and I'm so glad you love my songs! I had the blessing of getting them produced by a local producer. And thanks for the recommendation of Tom Mohr. I'll look into that. Yeah, I didn't have luck with OCP so far, but I was blessed to get my song, We Adore You, published by GIA just very recently (See my song's page on their website as it is available for download but not print yet), so that is exciting.  I'd be down to collaborate and definitely...

This is one of my personal favorites

Author: Jeremy St Martin
What a timeless peace!

Greg

Author: Jeremy St Martin
Greg does.  https://soundcloud.com/gregory-ricci-301818298/a-sound-and-a-devil?utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing

Collaboration on songs

Author: Richard Schletty
Brian, your songs are sublime, your voice is an ointment and your soundbeds are top quality. I would be interested in collaborating with you. I could use your voice on some of my songs and hymns. Perhaps I can do some cowrites with you. Let's talk. By the way, I was disappointed by OCP.org not accepting any of the three co-written songs I submitted a few years ago. It's a hard nut to crack. Richard Schletty Owner/admin: schlettysound.com schlettydesign.com hungryforheaven.com insong....

Seek advice from Tom Mohr

Author: Richard Schletty
Brian, I suggest that you seek advice about self promotion from Tom Mohr. See his letters, songs and podcasts: https://www.tommohr.com/about-5 https://topcatholicsongs.com/rising-leader-series-tom-mohr-completion https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/author-tom-mohr-launches-the-rising-leader-series-a-year-long-series-sent-to-the-next-generation-of-leaders-301453400.html Contact me at info@topcatholicsongs.com if you would like Tom's email address.

reply

Author: ronsue
No I don't Ron

Indeed.

Author: Jeremy St Martin
Thank you for your comment. I would like to have your song about bread posted. Do you know which one I mean? Sincerely, Jeremy 

Opportunities in Songwriting for the Catholic Church

Author: brianjtucker
Hello all. I'm Brian Tucker, a Catholic singer/songwriter from Colorado Springs, CO who has released 9 songs in the contemporary Christian style (check out my songs like We Adore You at https://hyperfollow.com/briantuckermusic or briantuckermusic.com), and I'm now transitioning to becoming a songwriter for the Church in the contemporary Christian vein and especially writing songs for the liturgy and for adoration that elevat the beauty of mass. Anyone know besides pitching songs to OCP or GIA...

TOC for "Then Sings My Soul"

Author: Richard Schletty
See the TOC here: in the thumbnail previews. Then Sings My Soul, Volume 1 https://www.christianbook.com/then-sings-my-soul-volume-1/robert-morgan/9780785249399/pd/49397

The Story of Hymns

Author: Don9of11
I am not aware of that book. So I would be intrested in seeing the table of contents.   

Then Sings My Soul

Author: Richard Schletty
Don, have you ever seen the book Then Sings My Soul by Robert J. Morgan? It has  stories for 150 of the world's greatest hymns. ©2003. I can send you the table of contents if interested. We both know that there are lots of "greatest hymns" books abounding but I thought I would mention this one.

Music

Author: GregR
The guitar rolls along nicely with the lyrics  and the theological explanation provided some insight that I had not considered before.  

HAPPY NEW YEAR 2024

Author: asiansa09
I am grateful to celebrate the new year 2024 in the house of God, Jesus Christ & the Holy Family in sainthood's direction.

Beautiful devotional hymn

Author: Richard Schletty
I like your thorough survey of the hymn "Mother Dearest, Mother Fairest" at https://www.motherofmercycatholichymns.com/mother-dearest-mother-fairest/ The two sample tracks with voices are splendid, especially the recording from St. Cecilia Church. Love those harmonies. And the four different melodies are interesting. Well done!

A song of acknowledgment and appreciation of God's gifts

Author: Richard Schletty
Excellent words of faith. Nicely recorded by Diamond Garden Music. I'll have to look them up. Good to hear from you again, Dan Vi! I hope all is going well.

Very well done

Author: Jeremy St Martin
It is an interesting melody and wonderful lyrics.  Love still can be found! Some one should do a cover with harmony. In Christ, Fr. St. Martin Son of RONSUE

Resonant praise

Author: Richard Schletty
Another wonderful psalm setting. This one is especially resonant and immersive. Did you make some improvements with your recording equipment and DAW software? I hope that church communities discover your full three-year psalter. Having guitar-piano-voice sheet music will make them especially attractive. I know you are working on that. Blessings, Richard

Thanks Von!

Author: ckelley
Thank you for your kind words Von! Next time the Catholic Comedy Tour comes through NJ, I'll let you know!   Pax Christi, Dcn. Chuck   

Crooner

Author: VonBalthazar
Mel Tormé, aka "The Velvet Fog", comes to mind. After you finish mass and then your show at the Comedy Club, do a set of Standards at the local piano bar. Nice voice and lyrics! During my Spiritual Exercises class today, we got into the exchange between Jesus and Peter. Providential! Well done, Dcn Chuck! I can just imagine you providing the music and song as God judges each individual on the Day of Judgment. Between his mercy and your mellifluous voice, we can all dare to hope that all will...

Thanks for sharing

Author: ronsue
Very beautiful and thanks for giving us the lyric and music sheet music. Keep the songs coming! Ron St Martin  
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